Date: Mon Nov 26 2007 - 13:20:51 EST
I fully agree with Betty-Anne about sharing information with your colleagues. Before the Internet I was frequently made feel incompetent by some reps when certain features/procedure did not work on the cytometers. But that only until we started a local support group (the BBG in Boston) where we exchanged information and experiences. This not only helped me to learn technologies and tricks of the trade but often it turned out many flow-ers encountered the same problem I was told it was only my problem. The Internet changed that in a large scale. I am not advocating smear campaigns against any manufacturers. Distributing positive and negative opinions is educational. This list is a great source for knowledge. If the 300 or so out of office responses could be eliminated after each posts I bet more responses would come with "reply to all". I only have one wish: I want the manufacturers take an effort to respond to some of the reports on this list. They all are busy reading the messages but never step up to explain anything or defend themselves with arguments and facts. I am not sure why this is. Is is too much energy? Nobody is authorized to make public statements? I have the impression that most of them pretend this forum is not real and the raised issues go away if you ignore them. My impression is that this is a well balanced forum where the most competent colleagues of ours take their time to help us out. We all appreciate their contribution. Couldn't we modernize this list by making it a threaded, web based, searchable user group? Akos (Now I am bracing myself for the "out of office" messages.) __________________________ Akos Szilvasi NIBRI Core Laboratory Services manager USCA, 601-5301 Novartis Institutes for BioMedical Research, Inc. 100 Technology Square Cambridge, MA 02139 USA Phone: +1 617 8717177 Email : akos.szilvasi@novartis.com bmcbey@uoguelph.ca 11/23/2007 08:00 PM To Cytometry Mailing List <cytometry@flowcyt.cyto.purdue.edu> cc Subject Re: vitriolic analyzer service I disagree with sending evaluations to individuals and not to lists. I appreciate hearing what others have discovered with their instruments and it allows me to be less frustrated when I have one of those days with the Aria. She really can be a Diva even with a dedicated operator (which I am). I find if she is not used almost every day the problems get worse and you really have to calmly go through all the magic tricks that worked before. BD supports me, but I cannot afford the highest level of service they offer and I'm really getting terrified of the possiblility that after my first year service contract is over that I will be thrown in the deep end despite the excellent staff available at BD. I think that someone has to voice their frustrations sometimes in order for all of us to improve both the machines and the skills of the operators. Betty-Anne Quoting "Nebe-Von-Caron, G" <g.nebe-von-caron@unipath.com>: > Thanks Mario for giving me the word for today and how fitting was > the description for vitriolic: > > an acerbic tone piercing otherwise flowery prose > > > > Surely Uriel regrets having hit the "reply to all" after a > frustrating day as I had embarrassing moments like that myself. > > > > I guess some self moderation should work here. In general I would > think we try to send instrument evaluations to the individuals and > not to the list as they tend to be personal. Thus they also should > not be returned as summaries to the list. And what is best for one > is not necessarily best for someone else anyhow as most people have > no specification in mind on what they need. It only leads to buying > decisions like in the post recently were someone bought an Aria but > forgot to get an operator. > > High performance instruments need high performance drivers. It does > not help to buy the most advanced instrument just because one has > the budget. And no instrument is best for everything as they all > have to compromise somewhere. So try to write down your requirement > specification first. What are your major applications, what > parameters do you need, do you want / can you change the instrument > configuration, biohazard constraints, how much front end automation > do you need...? > > Experience with service varies greatly with the staff available from > the manufacturers, how you respect them and what your expectations > are. If treated with respect engineers tend to be the most helpful > species around as you will know from experience or if you get your > daily Dilbert. And the better you know your instrument the better > your service will be. And Mario - with regards to height - if I > would remember names right - I think Pat from Coulter in my service > area is probably head above all others - but I don't know exactly > how tall he is. > > The complexity of the sorters we use is very high. Thus it is not > too surprising if for example suddenly the manufacturer of the > camera module is gone you may be stuck, whether your electronic is > digital or analogue on the far end. Thus you can not service the > instrument with original parts therfore invalidating your service > contract obligations. I am sure BD will bend over backwards to try > to keep the Vantages going as Coulter does with the old Elites, but > all within reason. You may have to accept spare parts from used > machines or custom solutions that could invalidate your CE marking > etc. The problem is not the service that any of the companies > provide but the expectation that the customers may have (and the > lawyers that feed on it) so BD did well to start warning their > customers early - just they did not appreciate it. > > > > Gerhard Nebe-von-Caron > Research Scientist and Biomedical Engineer > > SPD-Spark > Swiss Precision Diagnostics > Priory Business Park > Bedford, MK44 3UP, UK > Tel +44(0)1234-835474 > Fax +44(0)1234-835002 > mailto:g.nebe-von-caron@unipath.com > > > > "I'd like to see a sunset... Do me a favour your majesty... Command > the sun to set." > > "If I commanded a general to fly from one flower to the next like a > butterfly, or to write a tragedy, or to turn into a seagull, and if > the general did not carry out my command, which of us would be in > the wrong, the general or me?" > > > > "You would be," said the little prince quite firmly. > > > > "Exactly. One must command from each what each can perform," the > king went on. "Authority is based first of all upon reason. If you > command your subjects to jump in the ocean, there will be a > revolution. I am entitled to command obedience because my orders are > reasonable." > > > > "Then my sunset?" insisted the little prince, who never let go of a > question once he had asked it. > > > > "You shall have your sunset. I shall command it. But I shall wait, > according to my science of government, until conditions are > favourable." > > > > "And when will that be?" inquired the little prince. > > > > "Well, well!" replied the king, first consulting a large calendar. > "Well, well! That would be around... around... that would be tonight > around seven-forty! And you'll see how well I'm obeyed." > > (from The Little Prince , Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) > > > > > > _________________________ CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE The information contained in this e-mail message is intended only for the exclusive use of the individual or entity named above and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivery of the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. 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